8.29.2008

the next chapter in an increasingly bizarre story



* * * *

Some notes.

1. In previous posts and comments on this topic, "CI" refers to the blog and blog community Common Ills, not to the person who posts under the name C.I.. I have had no dealings with C.I. the person except her recent demands that I take down the earlier posts. However, emails from Jess, Dona and Jim all used a Common Ills address, so I referred to them as Jess/CI, Dona/CI, and so forth, or referred to the whole community as CI.

2. Apparently, in her email to me, Dona alluded to - or thinks she did - information that is private within the CI community. Now the community is frantically demanding that I remove the posts. They are also demanding that the Campaign order me to remove the posts.

As I am not part of the CI community, Dona should not have disclosed private information about any of their members. The breach was hers, not mine.

Had I not posted the email, I could have forwarded it everyone I knew, who could have then forwarded it everyone they knew. If you want to keep something private, keep it private.

3. Nowhere in Dona's email, or in any emails from CI members to me, is the word "cancer" used.

4. To state the obvious, I did not post Dona's email in order to reveal private information about anyone in the CI community. The email was so rambling and convoluted that I didn't even realize there was personal information embedded in the verbiage.

5. This is the first item on the sidebar of The Common Ills blog.
Threats and abusive e-mail are not covered by any privacy rule. This isn't to the reporters at a certain paper (keep 'em coming, they are funny). This is for the likes of failed comics who think they can threaten via e-mails and then whine, "E-mails are supposed to be private." E-mail threats will be turned over to the FBI and they will be noted here with the names and anything I feel like quoting. This also applies to anyone writing to complain about a friend of mine. That's not why the public account exists.

6. It does seem that The Troll has entered the fray, after reading about the incident on wmtc. He has sent emails impersonating me, also claiming to be my female partner, to members of the CI community. This is an interesting development, and surely one with legal implications.

Needless to say, the CI community does not believe there is troll involvement. I am supposedly sending profanity-laced emails to these people. Allan asked if they would forward the emails to me, but they will not.

* * * *

Follow up wow.

The whole thing is very sad.

96 comments:

redsock said...

From Common Ills
Why she felt the need to post about my having gone undergone medical exams is a question she'll try to justify and try to excuse and maybe even play dumb on. But there's no excuse for what she did.

Again, CI's own policy refers to "failed comics who think they can threaten via e-mails and then whine, "E-mails are supposed to be private." ... they will be noted here with the names and anything I feel like quoting."

What is sad here is that they must clearly know that they have made a dumb mistake -- and are concocting a bigger and bigger lie (and smoke screen) to hide the fact that they goofed up -- and are too ashamed to come clean now.

***

To any Common Ills person reading this:

Forward one of the allegedly emails to me. Just ONE. Why is that not possible? You say there are dozens. Print a screenshot of one on your website. Something. Show us the emails you are so angry about actually exist.

Also, you claim that L wrote 15 letters to the editor of the New York Times specifically trashing your group. Show us the letters. Show us ONE of the letters. You say they are archived online. Post the URLs at your site.

Why won't you further expose these horrible acts that have allegedly occurred?

redsock said...

In the more recent CI post:
Now you might think, "She's outed someone as having cancer. She's done that publicly and online.

Again, "cancer" does not appear in the email. Go back to the post and read it again. Do a search for the word "cancer". Find anything? No. You know why? Because the word "cancer" does not appear in the email.

Dharma Seeker said...

Wow is right! CI = double standards! In their first e-mail to you wasn't it implied, if not stated outright, that you should have taken the time to go through CI's older posts before contacting them? If CI took its own advice and read WMTC's older posts there would no doubt about the existence of the troll.

Given the flurry of e-mails is it safe to assume they've also had a change of heart about pen pals? In your shoes I wouldn't even give them the satisfaction of a reply e-mail. I'd just keep posting away, and let CI's lame, assy, and hypocritical conduct continue speak for itself.

redsock said...

So surely, she and her chump are going to mention somewhere in their 7K e-mail

The email I sent last night was not 7,000 words. It was 354 words. Also, I sent it on my own, as Laura is not corresponding with these people any more.

In the interest of full disclosure -- something in which CI should also participate -- here is the complete email (sent to both Martha and CI at 11:49 PM):

***

Hi, I am Laura Kaminker's partner.

Could you please forward to me the offending emails you believe she sent, cursing at Mike, Rebecca, or other members of the Common Ills community?

There is a virulent troll that has harassed Laura's blog (and my Red Sox baseball blog) for more than a year. Over the last few months, he has been impersonating both Laura and myself, leaving racist, homophobic and anti-abortion and anti-war resister comments at other blogs under similar names to ours.

For example, Laura posts as "l-girl" (lower case L) -- this troll pretends to be her by posting as "i-girl". (In Blogger, l and i are quite difficult to distinguish.) I post as "redsock" -- the troll posts as "redsock." (note the additional period). He has also pretended to post as Laura at the Toronto Star website as "laura-wmtc".

Since you claim that Laura sent emails with loaded with f-words *today* -- which she absolutely did not do -- it appears that troll is getting into the middle of this fray, trying to damage Laura's reputation and the war resisters campaign. The troll tried to leave a comment at Laura's blog at about 5 PM today, claiming that he had been in contact with CI and that CI was preparing to "'release" these past abusive emails that Laura allegedly wrote. (Release them to *whom*, I'm not really sure.)

Anyway, this troll may be sending emails to you guys claiming to be Laura.

Laura has two (and only two) email addresses: movetocanada at gmail and laurakaminker at gmail. (Please note correct spelling and non-punctuation of both.) If the nasty emails you have received are from **any other addresses**, they are NOT from Laura.

If you forward the offending emails to me, perhaps we can figure out what is truly going on.

Thank you.

Allan Wood

P.S. We were also completely confused by the accusation that Laura allegedly wrote 15 letters to the New York Times criticizing CI's coverage of the war resisters. She did not write even one letter. But if you could also provide some evidence of this, I'd really appreciate it.

****

L-girl said...

In their first e-mail to you wasn't it implied, if not stated outright, that you should have taken the time to go through CI's older posts before contacting them? If CI took its own advice and read WMTC's older posts there would no doubt about the existence of the troll.

Excellent point! I hadn't even thought of that.

Given the flurry of e-mails is it safe to assume they've also had a change of heart about pen pals?

:)

In your shoes I wouldn't even give them the satisfaction of a reply e-mail.

That's exactly what I'm doing, not so much for their lack of satisfaction as for my own blood pressure level.

I receive an email that demanding - not asking, not requesting, but demanding - that I change something on my own blog, you can be sure I'm not communicating with the sender.

Also, their previous email to me ended with these two words: "Don't reply."

So I'm not.

M@ said...

It's hard not to just dismiss these guys as drunks, or psychopaths. They're just bizarre.

I found references to a "health scare" and "medical tests" in that long, rambling e-mail you posted. I guess you should have known by that exactly what the health issues were, just as we all did. (You got your medical degree WHERE?!)

I must say that those two blog posts are very difficult to read, even more so than the long e-mail. Do they write like that all the time?

Anyhow, they're obviously upset and not dealing very well with whatever issues they have. It's sad that they've made you the target for all their problems. All you can do at this point is just stay away.

Frankly, though, I find it hard to believe that a third party's three kids all read a post on an unconnected blog and inferred from a couple of very vague references that their mother (I think?) has cancer. Talk about drama queens.

L-girl said...

I must say that those two blog posts are very difficult to read, even more so than the long e-mail. Do they write like that all the time?

Yes. I couldn't read either of them.

Frankly, though, I find it hard to believe that a third party's three kids all read a post on an unconnected blog and inferred from a couple of very vague references that their mother (I think?) has cancer.

Allan and I were saying the same thing last night. Her kids? Her kids are reading wmtc?? How did that happen?

And if they are - which is extremely doubtful - do "medical tests" mean mom has cancer?

Tres bizarre.

redsock said...

Frankly, though, I find it hard to believe that a third party's three kids all read a post on an unconnected blog and inferred from a couple of very vague references that their mother (I think?) has cancer. Talk about drama queens.

Buried in one of the novellas over there is this:

"Someone saw her nonsense online and asked my son, "Is the cancer back? Why was your mother doing a week's worth of medical exams?""

This is apparently how things went down:

1. A CI blogger goofed up and sent some personal info in an email to L.

2. L posted the email to show how loopy these people are. Buried in there is something about "medical exams".

3. An adult reads this email on wmtc and decided to take this information -- from a blog that was currently in some sort of spat with CI -- to a child and ask him if it was true.

4. Note that this unnamed adult is the first person who uses the word "cancer" -- in speaking to this child.

5. And this is all L's fault.

***

Hooooooooo-kay!

redsock said...

They have posted about this yet again!!!

OY!

redsock said...

DEAR CI:

SHOW US THE EMAILS
SHOW US THE EMAILS
SHOW US THE EMAILS
SHOW US THE EMAILS
SHOW US THE EMAILS
SHOW US THE EMAILS
SHOW US THE EMAILS
SHOW US THE EMAILS


Present your evidence for fuck's sake.

Forward the emails to me or post screenshots of them -- don't you want to further humiliate Laura?

Let's go already!

James said...

Just a quick point in response to the claim that there is no troll: there are plenty of posts on the blog about the troll, and they all predate this dust-up. It would only take a moment or two to verify that.

L-girl said...

From that site:

Jess' reply to her notes at the top that he knows the stunts she pulled last year with Rebecca and Mike. And strangely, ____ never offers her "nasty troll" excuse at her own site. Never brings it up until she's worried she's about to be outed.

I repeat: to my knowledge, The Troll became involved yesterday, for the first time.

I would love to see "the stunts" that I supposedly "pulled" last year on Mike and Rebecca.

I have posted everything that comes up from my Gmail archives.

I'm not in the habit of sending abusive emails to people who support war resisters! Or to people who don't, for that matter.

One of the craziest parts of this was that my email exchange with Mike was friendly and positive. He complimented wmtc and told me to keep up the good work!

Oy. Well, back to work for me.

L-girl said...

Just a quick point in response to the claim that there is no troll: there are plenty of posts on the blog about the troll, and they all predate this dust-up. It would only take a moment or two to verify that.

Recent wmtc discussion about the troll: July 19, 2008.

redsock said...

From CI's latest post:

I've just read the garbage ____ e-mailed that Ava was commenting on last night. The, "It wasn't me, it was this mean nasty troll and I'm under so much stress" garbage.

I reposted the email I sent. Anything in there about stress?

No. Of course not. They are lying.

Please show me a screenshot of the email where I talk about anyone being under stress.

Jess' reply to her notes at the top that he knows the stunts she pulled last year with Rebecca and Mike.

SHOW US THE STUNTS.
SHOW US THE STUNTS.
SHOW US THE STUNTS.
SHOW US THE STUNTS.
SHOW US THE STUNTS.

SHOW US THE STUNTS.

SHOW US

THE STUNTS.


Because ____ contacted this site on behalf of the organization -- that's how she represents in her e-mails. Meaning those replies weren't her personal e-mails.

Laura reprinted the emails, showing this claim is a lie. If there are other emails ...

SHOW US THE EMAILS.
SHOW US THE EMAILS.
SHOW US THE EMAILS.
SHOW US THE EMAILS.


CI is like George W. Bush -- expecting us to take his flimsy claims on nothing more than his say-so.

Jen said...

Oh my god, what a nightmare. I've had innocent remarks blow up, but never on such a grand and public scale. This truely sucks. Personally, I'd blame whoever had put private info into an email to a stranger, or myself for not making it clear enough that it was private info.

For the record & for what it's worth, The Troll posts at my blog, Keep Insite Open, posing as L-girl ("i-girl) on July 5th. The Troll was as well known in your regular readers as apparently The Cancer was over there. Unfortunately, there was no cross-pollination.

You're prolly not looking at their (i.e.: the multiple CI's--I'm really not clear on many, many details) site anymore (?), but there's another update:

http://thecommonills.blogspot.com/2008/08/iraq-china-etc.html

Jen said...

CI: And strangely, ____ never offers her "nasty troll" excuse at her own site. Never brings it up until she's worried she's about to be outed.

L-Girl I repeat: to my knowledge, The Troll became involved yesterday, for the first time.

Your readers do mention the troll in the comments from the start. However one would have to know that "Mags" and "Mags 2000" = the troll.

Also, I missed Allan's link to the CI post previously. Sorry.

James said...

Mags was doing the rounds on July 5th. He posted to my site as well, though as himself and not under "I-girl" or "redsock."

L-girl said...

Thanks Jen.

Yes, it's quite amazing.

Your readers do mention the troll in the comments from the start. However one would have to know that "Mags" and "Mags 2000" = the troll.

I'm pretty sure wmtc commenter Lorna mentions the troll, with concern that he may have opened an email account with my real name with another domain.

But really, these people are not interested in facts. We are all sitting here posting facts, and they are in their own fantasy-based world.

L-girl said...

* mentions the troll as troll, not by name

L-girl said...

Mags was doing the rounds on July 5th. He posted to my site as well, though as himself and not under "I-girl" or "redsock."

Thanks for that, James. Extra bonus, I get to see all the pups frolicking together.

We should do a pup play date soon. Unfortunately, I'm overcommitted for Labour Day, but maybe you guys are free on the Monday of (Cdn) Thanksgiving.

Canada Calling said...

Bizarre. I'm sorry you have been made a target in this cover-up for CI’s faux pas. It makes me wonder about the reality content of CI as a whole. They clearly are not interested in finding out all the facts.

john said...

So, having read all your posts on this topic, and CI's various responses, I've reached a conclusion: CI is an outfit I'd never heard of before, and hope never to hear of again. Comparing your detailed, reasonable communication with their hysteria has been interesting...

redsock said...

Cute pup, CC.

redsock said...

liar ... piss ant ... gutter trash ... LUNATIC ... COWARDS ... an insane woman ... gutter trash. ... gutter trash ... Gutter trash ... bitch ... COWARD ... bitch ... Again, the word is BITCH ... they will always be GUTTER TRASH ... Kiss my Latina ass, you dumb f--king COWARD ... Kiss my Latina ass, you stupid, stupid COWARD ...

Well, at least they are taking the high road.

M@ said...

Well, at least they are taking the high road.

They went to finishing school WHERE!?

No, I'm just not getting tired of that.

L-girl said...

They went to finishing school WHERE!?

No, I'm just not getting tired of that.


It will have a long life. It's already been used on JoS - and not by either me or Allan! "And you got your scouting degree WHERE!?"

James said...

We should do a pup play date soon. Unfortunately, I'm overcommitted for Labour Day, but maybe you guys are free on the Monday of (Cdn) Thanksgiving.

That may be doable. That weekend will be the Second Annual Stoverly Aussie Reunion, but it'll likely be the Saturday, so that works well.

This Saturday, BTW, is Cobalt's second Agility Fun Run. :)

L-girl said...

Btw, here is my name in a New York Times archives search.

This is a bit less than half the letters I have had published in the NYT, between 1991 and 2004.

I have had no letters in the Times since 2004, and have had no letters in the Times about war resisters. And certainly none about CI!

Perhaps Allan would like to grab the text that this refers to. I believe "dumbass" is the operative search string.

redsock said...

Here we go:

***
If you read the snapshot, you'll see that what it all boiled down to was ____ didn't like Robin Long being said to be extradited. She never likes anything. Which is why, before the coward ran to Canada (cowards are people who leave a country due to who the ruler is instead of fighting -- cowards are not war resisters whose very resistance makes a difference), she had to write one letter after another to the editor of the New York Times over and over which Dona says ___ denies at her site. Dumb ass, NYT is online now. Their archives are online for those who pay or subscribe to the paper. Plus, you really got a repuation at the paper because you couldn't stop writing.
***

No offence, L, but I'd be surprised if anyone at the Times knows you're alive.

Where are these letters? Give us the URLs, some screenshots, something. I'm dyin' to read these things.

And again I'll ask:
HOW DO THEY KNOW you allegedly wrote more than a dozen unpublished letters about them to the New York Times?

L-girl said...

Interesting that the old "coward" taunt has re-surfaced.

Living one's life as one sees fit can never be cowardly, whether that means staying firmly rooted in the US or moving elsewhere or anything else.

However, as we've said many times: pulling up stakes, quitting well-paid jobs, giving up a rent-stabilized large Manhattan apartment, leaving family and friends, going to a new country and city, without jobs, where we reasonably expected to make 2/3 or 1/2 of our former salaries, was not exactly an act of cowardice.

I don't need a medal for it, but one would not expect a cowardly person to embark on such a journey.

L-girl said...

Thanks, A. You missed this bit from Dona's email:

As you did with Rebecca and Mike (who never linked to you -- C.I. linked to you in the snapshots, they reposted C.I.'s snapshots), you e-mailed your gripe. You tossed "Thank you" at the front and acted friendly and then did what you did in -- what? 15? -- letters to The New York Times which was to offer how C.I. was wrong.

* * * *

No offence, L, but I'd be surprised if anyone at the Times knows you're alive.

And they went to journalism school where?!

redsock said...

I don't need a medal for it ...

I wouldn't mind a getting a medal -- a big medal made of chocolate. With some almonds in it. And maybe a big glass of cold milk (with two ice cubes in it to keep it cold because I like to save most of the milk for last and gulg it down, though I really run the risk of getting a wicked bad cold headache if I do that, and even though it's happened a lot in the past, with me dancing in place because my forehead is intensely frozen, there I am, just a-gluggin' away like maybe I'll avoid it just this one this time ... of course I never avoid it ... so yeah, that's what I deserve). Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Joe Grav said...

Time to open up a can of whoopass

Joe Grav said...

of the legal variety

Joe Grav said...

I see that the CI people are fans of Ralph "I haven't done anything worthwhile in years" Nader. That's all I need to know.

Dharma Seeker said...

I'm a big believer in trying not to pass judgement on people, but anyone who denounces someone as a Drama Queen yet planned to announce her own health problem via "newsletter" seems a little odd.

L-girl said...

I see that the CI people are fans of Ralph "I haven't done anything worthwhile in years" Nader. That's all I need to know.

I hope that's not all you need to know, since both Allan and I voted for Nader in 1996 and 2000.

We managed to vote for Kerry in 2004, but if I were voting this year, I would vote for Nader again.

So perhaps there is more to know besides who CI supports!

L-girl said...

Oh Joe, that should have had a smiley thingy next to it. So here it is. :)

Sarah Gates said...

Sheesh...

For what it's worth, the troll's come to see me as well, telling me (as redsock.) that I was no longer welcome at JoS. There's plenty of evidence of the troll prior to this nonsense, if these cranks cared in the slightest about fact checking.

Ignore them, Laura, they're sad, small people.

L-girl said...

And through all this, something I think we haven't mentioned:

They are no longer going to link to the Campaign! They contacted the Campaign and demanded - and I mean demanded - that they tell me take down posts on my own blog. ("Let me be clear: those emails come down.")

The Campaign told them I was a well respected volunteer and member of the community, and [he] hopes the dispute can be resolved satisfactorily, but it has nothing to do with them.

And now they are boycotting the Campaign!

So this little hatefest - and getting their way - is more important to them than the work we're all trying to do.

Priorities.

Amy said...

Laura, It pains me just to read all this. I cannot even bring myself to read it all or even all the comments here in response. My heart goes out to you. This kind of stuff would drive me into a dark place. You have my support. My stomach hurts for real thinking about it.

I am sorry you are experiencing this.

M@ said...

They're starting to sound like psychopaths. A lot of people ratchet up the crazy when they go online, of course, but this is not a stable or intelligent response to the problem.

Mary said...

"This is a bit less than half the letters I have had published in the NYT, between 1991 and 2004."

Showoff :)

"So this little hatefest - and getting their way - is more important to them than the work we're all trying to do."

Incredible ... simply incredible.

I've been following this with morbid fascination: how much appetite do these people have for self-inflicted public humiliation? Apparently it is limitless. I've never seen anything quite like it ...

L-girl said...

Sarah, Amy, thank you. :) I really appreciate it, and you guys help me feel much better.

Showoff :)

Ha, guilty as charged! :)

If letters published in newspapers and magazines "counted" on a writing resume, I'd be famous. But alas.

I do have a high success rate, though. When my letters don't make it in, a nearly identical one by someone else does, which is almost as good.

self-inflicted public humiliation

That really sums it up. Thanks!

L-girl said...

Wingnut_2000 is now denying sending any emails under false or impersonating names.

He has a pretty poor track record - how many times has he sworn to leave this blog alone?? - but if true, the CI gang is even worse than I thought.

If Troll has not been emailing them posing as me, then their entire premise of having received all these profanity-laden, hateful emails from me is completely fabricated.

Since the full extent of my emails with Mike and Rebecca is posted on this blog - yet CI insists I had "heated exchanges", "trashed" and "pulled a stunt" on M&R - more lying is consistent with their MO.

redsock said...

If Troll has not been emailing them posing as me, then their entire premise of having received all these profanity-laden, hateful emails from me is completely fabricated.

Or we are back to our first possibility -- that they confused you with someone else. But if that was the case, you'd think that after all of this, they might have gone back to whatever emails they have (if any actually exist) and double-checked to see that they had fingered the right person.

If they invented this ENTIRE scenario out of thin air -- the back-and-forth squabbles via email with more than one person, the 15 unprinted letters to the Times bad-mouthing them that they somehow found out about, the f-word-laden emails that they supposedly received from you yesterday -- not to mention the claim that you have "destroyed" someone's children -- is mind-boggling.

Yet this is the reality of what we are left with.

Since they have produced not one iota of evidence that anything they are claiming actually exists, we must assume they are making this entire thing up.

redsock said...

Let's remember: in all their posting on this -- thousands and thousands of words -- they have yet to quote even 2 or 3 words that L supposedly wrote to them in anger.

They have ignored my email asking for even a shred of proof of their claims. Yet wouldn't they want to broadcast these emails far and wide and humiliate L -- who they have an intense hatred of (now) -- as much as possible? If they have the goods, nothing is stopping them from unloading with both barrels.

They could crush her and claim the ultimate victory -- exposing her as a huge liar and all-around asshole!

Yet they have done nothing but bleat over and over that they have this mountain of evidence that contradicts everything L and I have said. And they steadfastly refuse to allow any of it to see the light of day? WHY?

So taking that into account and (what the hell!) taking Mags at his word:

I now firmly believe that they have absolutely no evidence whatsoever.

There are no angry email conversations between L and any one of these people (or anyone they know).

There are no letters to the editor.

There are no recently-sent f-word-soaked emails.

No communication exists beyond what L quoted a few days ago.

Nothing exists.

They are making all of this up.


Now ... WHY they have done this made up this soap opera is completely beyond my powers of deduction. Remember: this is not one strange person typing all alone, this is several different people (three, I think) all totally whipped up into a frenzy together.

Over what? Because L preferred the word "deported" to "extradited"?

L-girl said...

Over what? Because L preferred the word "deported" to "extradited"?

One theme I see in their novellas is that I dared to email them at all. I can't go back and get all the references right now - too busy and it's not worth it - but it appears that they cannot tolerate any sort of communication from outsiders.

My emails to Mike & Rebecca were, in reality, thanking them and cheering them on. But to them, it was condescending! I trashed them, etc.

My email re extradition was... well, it was beyond the pale. I got my law degree when, etc.

They don't have comments on any of their blogs.

Someone emailed me to say that "at the slightest whiff of criticism, CI will circle the wagons and attack, attack, attack". I see that, and what's more, it appears that everything is construed as criticism!

Kim_from_TO called it yesterday. Power and control freaks. When I posted their emails, they lost control of the material, and it's making them nuts.

s1c said...

Ok, I have read their posts and went back to reading the letters. Unbelievable.

Don't worry though it looks like they are going to continue to trash you as the last paragraph of their Iraq snapshot today has this to say - They end up getting the Gutter Trash's stark raving partner screaming at them in e-mails. Well, we know they have no ethics. Until Third on Sunday, that's all I plan to say. We will address it there and some community sites will address it now.

As they say sometimes, more to come.

redsock said...

screaming. yeah.

redsock said...

And once again, absolutely no proof of anything.

Because NONE OF THIS EXISTS.

s1c said...

I have one question before I get ready to go to work.

It looks like they are putting pressure on the Organization that you have been working with, have they said anything to you about this whole incident?

L-girl said...

It looks like they are putting pressure on the Organization that you have been working with, have they said anything to you about this whole incident?

They sent several emails to the Campaign, demanding that they make me take the posts down.

A person in a position of leadership said, "I don't know anything about this, and don't think the Campaign has any reason to be involved.

Laura is a very respected member of our community, who works hard to help our cause.

I hope this can be resolved in a satisfactory way. Thank you for your support of the resisters as well."

Then they went absolutely friggin ballistic at the Campaign, and now will not link to them anymore or help in any way. (What dedication!)

That's been the extent of it.

I'll tell ya, I'm grateful I've been working with the Campaign a full year and people know me. Otherwise who knows what people would think?

I'm going to see people Monday in the Labour Day parade. I imagine we'll talk about it then.

s1c said...

Good for the campaign. Good for you also, I see that they are going to be doing something at the RNC. Hmmm, am toying with some ideas about that.

deang said...

I'm glad the Campaign isn't falling for their attempts to impugn you. It is good that your excellent work for the war resisters has earned you the Campaign's support. I can't help but suspect that the CI people are trying to limit the Campaign's very successful work by injecting a baffling fight into the middle of it and forcing people to waste time on it. Ain't gonna work.

nick said...

wheeee!

I confess that I didn't really read your blog posts on this issue earlier. I saw the beginning of the "pen pals" email and decided I didn't have for someone else's delusional dramatics (I find levels of that around me often enough--apparently I've jumped the shark 'bout something-or-other).

Now, in a fit of 2am-ness, I've gone back and read it all, including non-related posts on various CI sites. whew.

Not being in your position, it's easy for me to say, but... why spend more time on this?

They are clearly non-rational people with too much anger and spite, spraying their frustrations across anything they pass. There is no way to win or draw even with people like this--you only get sucked into their dimension-bending vortex of life-suckage. don't succumb.

You've made a logical case here to demonstrate the inanity of it all. At this point, what further relevance is there beyond their own spittled echo chamber?

Enjoy baseball. enjoy impending fall foliage (if they have trees in Canada). grills, drinks, sunsets, pets, pleasant connections with people working to make the world a better place. There are so many positive outlets for our energies...

Timothy said...

As a War Resister, I am grateful for the work you do, and a little irritated that CI has apparently bothered the WRSC with this. It's not like they don't have their hands full enough as it is...

I'm not taking sides in all this, because we're all supposed to be on the same side. Just know you're aces in my book!

L-girl said...

why spend more time on this?

As I've said many times, I posted it because this was upsetting. Sharing, and getting feedback and support, made me feel much better.

Then a discussion arose, and out of respect for the commenters - and also because it's the way I run this blog - I responded to comments.

I'm not obsessing on it. It's not the only thing I'm posting about. But it is a thread, and I'm not going to close comments on it.

Enjoy baseball. enjoy impending fall foliage (if they have trees in Canada). grills, drinks, sunsets, pets, pleasant connections with people working to make the world a better place. There are so many positive outlets for our energies...

With all due respect Nick, I do all these things, all the time. But sometimes there is conflict in our lives, and conflict does not go away because someone else tells us to ignore it.

If you don't like to read about this, it's easily avoided. I was receiving nasty emails and this group was dragging the Campaign into it. It was not happening on someone else's blog - it was happening in my life. So I couldn't avoid it.

L-girl said...

Thank you Tim!

Charles said...

They kind of remind me of the Larouche people. Does anybody take these green inkers seriously? I had never heard of them before reading about them here.

L-girl said...

The Troll has emailed me for the first time, to forward me his correspondence with the CI folks. He claims this is the only email he has sent to them. I think I actually believe him.

+ + + +

Subject line: stop fucking with laura-wmtc

thats my job.

+ + + +

The reply, which he forwarded to me:

+ + + +

Subject line: stop fucking with laura-wmtc

Thanks for your lovely e-mail. We'll be sure and do a lengthy article on it and Laura's on Sunday. We'll pull from the e-mails to Mike and Rebecca as well.
Kiss my Black Ass.
Ty

+ + + +

Joe Grav said...

OK, that's not "all I need to know," I guess - but I still am not a Nader fan :-p

L-girl said...

but I still am not a Nader fan :-p

Nor would I expect you to be. :)

Kim_in_TO said...

I'm back in grade school! I am whisked right back to those days in which there was always someone creating drama. Even in high school, I remember one girl who was never happy unless someone else was unhappy. The exclusion (bullying), the serious heart-to-heart talks about what to do about so-and-so, the tears in the hallway... it was all instigated by one person who needed the drama, and dragged everyone else down. I thought those days were over.

It appears as though we're dealing with the truly unbalanced here. I'm talking "off their meds", quite literally. You're right; it really is sad.

The only other thing I can think of is the speculation of the government planting agents-provocateurs in leftist organizations in order to create disharmony. (I do know the RCMP and CSIS do it to spy on organizations.)

Whatever. (Normally, I'm wary of using that word/phrase, as it shows such disrepect, but here it is clearly warranted.) They didn't succeed in creating any problems for you at the WRSC. We all know what good work you do. If they were decent people, they would be supporting the war resisters, but they've shown their true colours. And the silver lining here is that all of your readers now know all about CI. I'd never heard of them before this, and I now know to avoid them at all costs.

Turnabout is fair play. Hey CI! Fuck you! Don't reply - I'm humming with my fingers in my ears.

Lisa said...

Uggh. I tried to read some of the drivel posted in the CI site, but it made my head hurt. And my blood pressure elevate. I agree with redsock...the whole thing is made much stranger by the fact that there seems to be more than one person being completely insane.

The troll thing I find even stranger though. "Subject line: stop fucking with laura-wmtc. thats my job." !!!

And he sends you emails (or comments or whatever) promising to stop harassing your blog, but then still does so?? Like, what, does he wake up in the middle of the night with pangs of conscience ?? He wishes he could stop but its a compusion? Weird.

Anyway, sorry that you are going through this crap! It IS totally sad.

JakeNCC said...

I just want to add to those offering support. I had never heard of CI before this and after what I read today I wish I never had. What comes to my mind is this is more of a cult than anything else. The way these people flock around this mysterious "C.I." is just bizarre. They all seem to have the same thoughts and poor social skills as if they were linked in some
"BOURG" way ( that's a star trek reference for those non-trekkies ). I don't know you other than recently reading your blog but I am sending out positive thoughts to you and hope you will not let this affect the good work you do and the life you enjoy.

A Conformer said...

I must say that I think there's a pretty simple explanation. Reading all of this epic mess, the one thing I can't shake is a feeling I get when reading everything "they" write. Unless you know any of them, or have some proof that these people actually exist, I'm willing to bet that it's all the same person. The fragmented, repetitive, very bad writing style is just way too uniform. The same ideas, the same motives, the same mind state, the same low attacks, the same apparent idolizing of this CI character... And the non-nuanced, overdone multi-racial aspect: "kiss my (latina/black/irish) ass". I don't know. It just seems like it's the same, kinda sick, person.
Laura, what do you think?

Daniel wbc said...

L,

I've always (well, since I started reading your blog :-) ) really respected the way you communicate. First, you have courage to state your views and not equivocate. Second, you are always open to more information. Third, you are respectful and human. If you don't understand something or think there's been a misunderstanding, you address it in a mature way.

I think you do a really good job of not only sharing what you think, but of educating people, encouraging people to discuss, form opinions and take action. You're articulate, educated, passionate and not a bully.

I'm too shy to go on ... I was going to send this to you privately, but decided to have some courage.

L-girl said...

Kim, you've really nailed it. Thanks for that. It's junior high all over again, except I won't let it be.

JakeNCC, thank you, truly.

Lisa, I know, crazy!! What a truly bizarre way to spend one's time.

Daniel, thank you doesn't even touch it. You continually embarrass me (in a good way) with your praise. Seriously. Aw shucks.

A Conformer, hmmm, I never thought of that. Could the entire CI group be one person with a series of names and email addresses? Either that or a cult.

Jen said...

I was just checking CI and thinking the same thing as Conformist.

On a loosely related note, [and I know I've mentioned this on your site before re: Troll, but now it applies even more to this situation] the novel "Set This House in Order" by Matt Ruff is a truely great read. CI et al need to read it and know that healthy living with multiple personalities is possible, but damned if I'm going to email it to them!

Lisa said...

I completely agree with conformer..

was going to mention (in past comments!..but didn't!) how identical the tone of "ava" and whoever else was..really really read like the same person. I am not sure they are in fact three people. Or maybe they are all on the same book? ... some groups are, it's hard to say. But they did sound SOO similar.

something to think about?

Joe Grav said...

Honestly, I still can't figure out what in god's name is going on. Let me know if there's anything I can do for you, L, although I suppose the best thing to do is let these weirdo cultists get out their anger and ignore them.

The funny thing is, they keep posting that you are obsessed with them, when they have about 15,000 extremely long posts about you on their front page.

Really, really odd.

L-girl said...

So we have many votes for they're all the same person. It sure does read that way, doesn't it??

Yet I wouldn't count out how alike cult members can sound.

But if it's one person, whoa, that would make it way sicker!! Can you imagine one person doing all that??

Let me know if there's anything I can do for you, L, although I suppose the best thing to do is let these weirdo cultists get out their anger and ignore them.

Thank you, Joe, much appreciated. That's what I'm doing for now - ignoring it (except chatting in comments) and assuming it will run its course. I've been done posting about them for a while.

Friends are monitoring their blogs to see if they cross a line I should really care about.

The funny thing is, they keep posting that you are obsessed with them, when they have about 15,000 extremely long posts about you on their front page.

Yup. And it's all wild lies and extreme exaggerations.

Allan emailed them once - 340 words, posted here, very calm and straightforward - but supposedly he sent them repeated emails, 1000s of words, all raging.

I emailed Rebecca once, last December, a cheery "thanks for your support, we will win this thing" email, which I've posted here.

But supposedly I sent her repeated, harassing emails in which I "trashed her". Which they keep threatening to make public, but do not. (I guess they haven't written them yet.)

Anyway... you know all this. I'll just finish my coffee and get out of here. Joining the campaigners and resisters to march in the Labour Day parade! See you later.

redsock said...

Sunday (yesterday) was supposed to be the big day.

"We will reveal everything on Sunday ... Sunday ... oh my god will she be sorry on Sunday ... you'll see what a bitch she is on Sunday ... Sunday ... Sunday ... only two more days ... Sunday ... are you ready? ... Sunday ... that's when it'll all blow up."

And so Sunday comes and goes and ...........

(crickets)

...

I do see that one of them is having an attorney pour over everything L has posted.

OMG -- PLEASE BRING AN ACTION AGAINST US - PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEASE! -- What in god's name are you waiting for???

redsock said...

Also, when you read their posts: these are supposedly journalism students! Who the hell is teaching these kids to write so shitty?

M@ said...

Also, when you read their posts: these are supposedly journalism students!

First, I can't read their posts.

I've tried.

I just can't do it.

Trying to parse their bullet-point approach is just too much work.

It's just too much.

As for their being journalism students, I can't say it surprises me.

Nothing about American journalism has impressed me in the last few years.

They certainly have the melodrama-about-the-wrong-issue approach right though.

Maybe they meant next Sunday? Or a Sunday? Or a sunny day?

L-girl said...

Hi anyone who is subscribing to this thread. :)

I marched in the Labour Day parade with the Steelworkers and the Campaign. 99% of the Cmampaign is completely unaware of this entire brouhaha.

The other 1% is the leadership who received the looney emails demanding that the Campaign make me take down the posts. And that person has written them off as the loonies they are.

So no harm done on this end, in any way that matters.

L-girl said...

I do see that one of them is having an attorney pour over everything L has posted.

The perfect opportunity to use our favourite line:

AND YOU GOT YOUR LAW DEGREE WHEN?!

L-girl said...

Maybe they meant next Sunday? Or a Sunday? Or a sunny day?

:-D

L-girl said...

This afternoon I googled my name + the word "blog". I wanted to see if any of their bizarre rants use my full name. (Allan is saving everything, just in case we ever need it for legal purposes.)

I found this doozy. This blogger - a member of the CI community - apparently thinks I commented on my own essay using my moniker "L-girl" in order to pretend I was someone else, other than the author of the piece!!

That is too funny.

The byline on the piece links to this blog. I write this blog as L-girl, and link back to the essay on the sidebar, saying it is mine, and it is published under my real name.

How many brain cells does it take to figure out that L-girl is Laura Kaminker and Laura Kaminker is L-girl?

If I wanted to pose as someone else, why would I use L-girl?

Jen said...

Laura, I read that yesterday and thought "At the very least he could've accused her of posting as i-girl and we'd have come full circle, it would implode in on itself and all just go away". Which, given your description of the "irreparable harm" it's done you (i.e. 1% of war resisters know/care) it pretty much has just gone away.

L-girl said...

it pretty much has just gone away.

Yes. It only hasn't if you go to their blogs. Like any other blog, if you don't like it and don't want to read it, it's easily avoided.

redsock said...

We waited ALL WEEK for CI to finally release the dreaded emails that would FINALLY expose Laura as the horrible person CI says she is.

There would be months worth of nasty emails she supposedly wrote to several different people. Nail her ass to the wall, they would.

They posted about it over and over: ON SUNDAY, ALL WILL BE REVEALED!!!! THE ABUSIVE EMAILS WILL BE RELEASED!!!! JUST WAIT UNTIL SUNDAY AND YOU WILL WITNESS THE UGLINESS!!!!

Well, guess what? Sunday came and Sunday went. Nothing. Nada. Zip. (What a shocker.)

BUT WAIT -- something was posted tonight (Tuesday). And those clever kids dated it Sunday! I guess they kept their promise after all! YAY!

But to see this HUGE NEWS that you have been waiting DAYS for, you have to scroll through -- I am not kidding -- more than 13,400 words to FINALLY get to the stuff about Laura.

Yet it is nothing more than the same silliness they have been posting for days (for quickness, go here and here.

In short: THEY DID NOT POST THE EMAILS THEY PROMISED TO POST.

And guess how they end the second of two posts about L?

Read:
Again, Dona, Jim and Jess are waiting until next Sunday to respond.

I think all of us feel the same way:

WE HAVE TO WAIT ANOTHER WEEK?????? BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

Join me in chanting:

What do we want? EMAILS!
When do we want them? NOW!
What do we want? EMAILS!
When do we want them? NOW!
What do we want? EMAILS!
When do we want them? NOW!

Also, if they are in consult with a lawyer about taking action against L & I, GET ON THE STICK! You have our names. Our address is public and/or very easily found -- hell, I'll give it to you if you email me -- TAKE US TO COURT!!!!!!

redsock said...

Heh. They also accuse L of a "prolonged" attack against them. I wonder how many words "they" (every single post is in the exact same writing style, so it may be the same person) have written since this thing started.

I should count, but I'll guess at least 30,000 (and showing no sign of slowing down).

Also, I like how their first new post mentioned how a "judge" would feel about all this. Hell, even Judge Judy would tell these kids to go fly a kite. Maybe they can send an email to Mike Judge or Judge Reinhold.

redsock said...

How many brain cells does it take to figure out that L-girl is Laura Kaminker and Laura Kaminker is L-girl?

5.2

But there are like eight people in this group. 5.2 b-cells is a lot of firepower for these kids.

Amy said...

I cannot bear to read their garbage, so I cannot for the life of me figure out what legal claim they are making. If anything, it seems that Laura would have the claim against them for libel. Do they ever describe what law they believe was "broken" by Laura??

JakeNCC said...

OK I did it. I actually read the Sunday (tuesday) Report and all I got out of it was a 4th "kiss my fill-in-the-blank ethnic ass" ( 2 black asses, 1 latino ass and 1 irish ass ) and the fact that ALL THESE NUTS live in the same house, The mysterious cult-leading C.I.'s house. As Laura would say, OY.

redsock said...

They have no legal claim whatsoever -- unless "I am really mad at someone" is now a valid reason to litigate. In which case, the courts are going to start getting mighty crowded!!!

The whole thing is laughable. They say they have an attorney looking at her wmtc posts. I guess they think they are scaring us, like when they said "my mom is a lawyer, you know"!!!! If that is true, then they know that personal emails are not protected by any privacy laws.

You send it out -- you lose control. Period. So: Be careful what you send out.

As I said, I am begging them to do something -- and to do it NOW! All this "gutter trash" hoo-haa is getting boring. Day after day -- the same old 2,000-word blather.

It's time for these kids to DO something.

redsock said...

Hello!

Another Sunday of posts -- an estimated 20,000 words -- and once again NOTHING about the horrific emails that L supposedly sent them.

They PROMISED they would print them about two weeks ago!

One of CI's earlier posts mentions the work done by "the investigators C.I.'s attorneys hired". The CI crew keeps threatening to sue L and I, but ..........

Nothing happens. Sigh.

M@ said...

You know, I'd be satisfied with a plausible explanation of how this blogger's child found and read the e-mail that Laura posted. I'm pretty sure they're not going to be providing proof of the supposed wrongdoing they suffered at your hands, but this grievance seems by far the least plausible.

I know when it comes to my parents' state of health, reading random blogs for tangential references to them isn't one of my primary sources of information.

L-girl said...

I know when it comes to my parents' state of health, reading random blogs for tangential references to them isn't one of my primary sources of information.

You prefer Facebook, then?

redsock said...

I prefer to walk random city streets looking for little scraps of paper to blow by -- you'd be surprised at what you can learn about your family that way.

M@ said...

Only Facebook pages of people I don't know. (Then again, my parents don't really use Facebook -- they're total luddites!)

L-girl said...

Me too. Quill pens and oil lamps only. I read parchment scrolls by candlelight.

M@ said...

Ah yes -- I remember seeing you in the third edition of Facetome, Volume XXIX. You should send me an acquaintance request some time!

I await your pigeon with great anticipation.

L-girl said...

This is just too funny. I am without retort.