When I tell people I am from the US - not that I advertise it, but it tends to come up in conversation - reactions fall into a few different categories. Some people are happy and excited; they understand the difference between the two countries and why an American might choose Canada. Interesting conversations ensue. But one fairly common reaction repeats itself nearly verbatim: "Why would you want to move here? We all want to move there!"
I first heard this during an interview at an employment agency, and let me tell you, I was taken aback. I hardly knew how to respond in a way that would be appropriate for a job interview. I laughed, played it down and changed the subject.
Since then, I've heard it many times, mostly from co-workers, but also from Canadian-born neighbours and in other casual interactions. To generalize, I would describe the people who say this as apolitical, largely ignorant of and unconcerned with events outside their own lives, and superficial. People who live in their own little world of family, friends, work and shopping.
By now I've figured out how to respond in a way that feels both comfortable and honest. The conversation goes like this.
Co-worker: You moved here from the US? Why would you do that? We all want to move there!
Me: Why do you say that?
Co-worker: The shopping is so good! We love to go to Buffalo to shop! [When we visit our relatives in Florida, we love to go shopping!] [My son lives in California, and when we go there, we shop all day!] [Etc.]
Me: There seems to be plenty of shopping here.
Co-worker: But things are cheaper there. You can get more for your money. There are more stores, too, a bigger variety.
Me: Next time you go shopping in Buffalo, think of two words: health care. Which would you rather have, free, guaranteed health care, or more stores?
Co-worker: Yeah, that's true! I hadn't thought of that!
Me: [it if still seems appropriate] Or think about Iraq. Which would you rather live in, a country that goes around the globe dropping bombs and invading other countries, or a peaceful nation where you don't have to worry about those things?
Co-worker: Oh yeah, you're right. We take all that for granted, but sure, that's true, I hadn't thought of that.
It doesn't take an hour of talk to get to that point. It takes only a bit of quick perspective. Nevertheless, the person's immediate reaction to the words "United States" is "cheap shopping". And cheap shopping is all you need to know, you'd rather live in a country that has it! (I never raise the issue of why shopping might be cheaper in the US. That seems too complex and abstract in this context.)
I've gotten so accustomed to this reaction in the workplace, I started assuming it. To the question, "Why did you move here from the US?" I started saying, "We wanted to live in Canada rather than the US, believe it or not." Little did I know, the person I said this to was more politically aware than I expected. She said, "Oh I can believe it. Good for you." She's a Canadian-born black woman with many relatives in the US. She was quite clear that her quality of life is better than theirs.
This "shopping" reaction, as I'll call it in shorthand, no longer surprises me, but it does still alarm me. Ignorance is so dangerous. Presumably these people vote. (Or do they?) How are they choosing their party and candidate? Are lower costs their first priority? Do they understand that higher taxes may be necessary for better services? And most importantly, do they fully recognize the rights and privileges they have as Canadians, and their responsibility to protect those rights?
Every so often on wmtc, I hear from Americans in Canada for non-political reasons - for jobs or family - who warn me about Canadian anti-Americanism. When I get more information, I generally find that they are confusing anti-US policy with anti-them. They carry the reflexive defensiveness that most Americans grow up with, the attitude that any criticism of the US is a personal attack.
The Canadians who pine over cheap US shopping and the Americans who feel threatened by criticism of the US government may be counterparts of each other. Each lives in an insular, superficial world. I'm used to that in Americans but it still bothers me in Canadians.
33 comments:
Where do you think this idea that quality of life in America is higher from? I generally tend to believe that it is the exposure to American media and culture, which is unabashedly pro-free market and indulges in celebrations of that system to the point of propagandic delusion.
Your thoughts, as an "import"? :)
Where do you think this idea that quality of life in America is higher from?
Many (most?) Americans grow up being told/taught that the US is the absolute highest state to which humans can evolve.
And if the US is not quite perfection, it is the closest to perfection of anywhere in the world. It simply "is".
Many (most?) Americans grow up being told/taught that the US is the absolute highest state to which humans can evolve.
And many Canadians grow up being told the same thing, thanks to US TV & other sources...
I remember the big hoopla over the introduction of Canadian characters into Sesame Street, which replaced the Spanish segments in Canadian broadcasts.
Where do you think this idea that quality of life in America is higher from?
I agree 100% with Allan (redsock).
Americans grow up hearing "This is the greatest nation on the face of the earth" over and over and over. It is drummed into your head everywhere and always. I can't even explain how pervasive this is. It's like the very air you breathe.
Combined with that, Americans are taught very little about the rest of the world, and see almost none of it on the mainstream media. There is so much more international news in Canada than in the US.
* * * *
On this blog, I often use the acronym TGNOTFOTE. A frequent commenter writes: GBA! TGNOTFOTE!
GBA is God Bless America.
That phrase is so common it might as well be one word. Godblessamericathegreatestnationonthefaceoftheearth.
Wait a second... I may have misunderstood the question.
Ryan, were you asking where *Canadians* get the idea that the quality of life in the US is higher than theirs?
I don't think Canadians think that. The "shopping" thing is only about consumerism.
I have been serving LEGIONS of Canadians at The Mall.
I'm not complainin' since they're paying my wages dodging the GST but it's kind of a bad influence on me since it just makes my accent that much worse.
It has always been a comfort that if things get really bad here I'm never far from a less scary country.
A corollary issue is that Americans almost always assume that those who come to the US to live do so because "everyone knows" that the US is the most desirable place on the earth to live. Having taught English as a second language in the US off and on over the years, I'm aware of the great variety of reasons people come to the US, and it's rarely because they think it's a paradise. It's usually out of economic necessity, an economic necessity often brought on by economic warfare that the US has waged against the migrant's home country (though the migrant isn't always aware of the political background). Yet, when I mention my teaching to Americans, they always assume that the migrant is now living a dream-come-true by being in the US. Sometimes that's true, but more often it's not.
A corollary issue is that Americans almost always assume that those who come to the US to live do so because "everyone knows" that the US is the most desirable place on the earth to live.
Oh yeah! Wingnuts who attack this blog often bring that up. "Then why does everyone in the world want to come here???"
A, because life sucks where they are, B, most people would much rather stay in their own countries if they could make a decent living and/or not be persecuted, C, lots of people also try to go to Canada, Australia, New Zealand, the UK, France, and other countries. There's this assumption that immigration is only to the US.
It has always been a comfort that if things get really bad here I'm never far from a less scary country.
If they get really bad?
Hi Laura,
I think the "cheap shopping" phenomenon you're seeing is shorthand for the following line of thought:
"Same quality of life, lower cost of living"
I know this, because my mom used to say the same thing. And she's a well-informed woman.
I think it's because our idea of cost of living encompasses a few things: rent/mortgage, food, clothing and entertainment.
When you look at just those things, sure, it's cheaper in the USA. As my mother was so fond of commenting, you get tax breaks on your mortgage (or something to that effect. She's the accountant, I tune out when the tax jargon begins), taxes are generally lower and the "Canadian markup" makes things more expensive relative to our salaries, even before the rise of the loonie. All you see is the greater disposable income you'll have and all that entails. More money for hobbies, gadgets, travel. Not having to wait until product X is released in Canada (iPhone, anyone??) etc.
But that's because other things, like health-care and schooling aren't even on the radar for us. We'd never think to factor in health insurance or private school tuition because even in big cities like Toronto, the public school system is excellent.
The common perception is also that Americans have the same quality of life as we do, or better. But unless you actually plan to move there, you never find out the subtle differences. I'm learning this the hard way now...
I'm transferring to the US office of my company for a few years and here are some of the unpleasant surprises I've received over the last few weeks. Keep in mind that it's an internal company transfer. I'm keeping the exact same job, exact same manager. Nothing changes except that I'll now be working remotely from a different location.
But I go from 3 weeks of vacation (and this was fresh out of university) to 2. If I was staying in Canada, I would have gotten an extra week of vacation for every 4 years of service to a max of 6 weeks per year. But no matter how long I'm with the company in the US, all I get is 2 weeks. Maternity/paterntity leave is almost pitiful in comparison. The things covered by my health insurance are not as extensive. Bereavement leave, disability leave, even sick leave are not the same. Retirement savings plan is not as generous. And this is just the employer. I haven't even considered the other changes in quality of life that depend on the country, state, city and society I'll be living in.
Anyway, that's my long-winded way of saying "I agree" :)
This attitude is a result of ignorance and taking things for granted. But one borne out of never having had to think about those things before. Unless you get an asthma attack or something, you never focus on your breathing and the process of getting air into your lungs.
Canrane
Canrane, thanks for the excellent comment.
I'd also like to note that taxes are generally not lower, unless you are very wealthy. The average person pays about the same taxes in the US and Canada. That defence budget has got to come from somewhere.
About your health insurance, even if you have decent coverage from your employer, you may have a huge payroll deduction plus a constantly escalating co-pay. And naturally the issue of what happens when you need the insurance, whether or not they will cover your needs.
I wish you lots of luck. Always keep in mind it's not the only company in the world.
And the irony, of course, is that cheap shopping is dependent on the Canadian dollar being strong. (Which health care isn't.)
I think Canrane answered my question. "Same quality of life, lower cost of living" is synonymous with "things are cheaper there." "Taxes are lower."
It's true. It's all about T.V. How much American TV do we get here that's actually critical of US domestic/foreign policy? I think it's tough to present realistic political discourse when the "left" is represented on American T.V. by Alan Colmes or Paul Begala.
How much American TV do we get here that's actually critical of US domestic/foreign policy?
How much American TV exists that is critical of US policy??
The Daily Show and now the Colbert Report. That's it.
But why are Canadians watching crappy US TV?
But beyond that, I'm not sure it's all about TV. I think it must have a lot to do with Canadians' inferiority feelings in relation to the US. That certainly pre-dates American TV being broadcast in Canada.
Funny, isn't it? So many Americans think life in Canada is worse than it is, and so many Canadians think life in the US is better than it really is.
The one area is really notice a difference isn't price (well, sometimes there is, but that can generally be eliminated by ordering from amazon.com instead of amazon.ca) but availability. I've seen on US websites women's shoes going up to size 12, and I hear The Gap goes up to size 20. I can find a dozen websites that sell the discontinued cosmetics I'm looking for, but none of them will ship outside the US. Like not even if you pay them more money. A CD I was looking for could be downloaded for $8, but they wouldn't let you download from outside the US - Canadians only have the option of buying the actual physical CD (which I don't even want) for $30. You can't buy TV shows or movies through iTunes here either, which is enough to drive one to piracy. And just now I wanted to watch a behind-the-scenes trailer thing that someone sent me a link to, but I couldn't watch it because it's on Hulu. This is essentially an advertisement for a DVD that I've already ordered, but they won't let me watch it.
And this is all just in the past week!
Hmmm, that sounds like something that could be the source of an inferiority complex - a lifetime of being told "No, we will not permit you to purchase our products, not even if you pay us extra!" Unless, of course, we manage to infiltrate them and walk among them undetected
I experience this same issue from a slightly different perspective. Most people assume I have moved to Canada from the UK because life was too expensive there. Whilst it is true that money does go somewhat further here - I now own a car which was not really an affordable luxury for me in Britain - I don't think that the difference is substantial enough to be the sole motivator. The standard of living of any western European eligible to immigrate to Canada (e.g. skilled worker or investor) is quite frankly as higher as anyone could reasonably expect and much higher that the planet can sustain for much longer (off topic sorry!).
I also get frustrated when people talk about 'quality of life' when they mean 'cost of living', these are not at all the same thing - i'm sure there is no need to spell out why here....!
And finally - I'm not sure that this Canadian inferiority complex that people mention above has made it to Alberta, I've been told by several people that I've moved to the best province in the best country in the world. Please don't get me wrong - I love Alberta and Canada, but I'm not sure that there is a 'best' country (and I'm pretty sure the people who said this had not undertaken an exhaustive tour of the others.........)
Re ImpStrump's comment, we've noticed that kind of thing, too. We were very surprised by it at first. It can be frustrating and annoying.
On a more specific note --
and I hear The Gap goes up to size 20
-- this is not true, at least not their NY-area stores. Women with large *anything* can't shop at the Gap in NYC or NJ.
WER, if it follows naturally in conversation here, it's not off-topic. You're hardly a thread hijacker. :)
I'm not sure that this Canadian inferiority complex that people mention above has made it to Alberta, I've been told by several people that I've moved to the best province in the best country in the world.
The Alberta attitude sounds so American! Which is the stereotype of Alberta. But I'm sure Idealistic Pragmatist would disagree.
...it is the exposure to American media and culture, which is unabashedly pro-free market and indulges in celebrations of that system to the point of propagandic delusion.
America is much better than Canada when it comes to creating a national mythology. Here's an exercise for Canadian readers of this blog: visualize the Oval Office. Got it? OK, now visualize the Prime Minister's office.
Or for you non-Torontonians: name off some neighbourhoods in Toronto. Difficult? Then try the same thing for Los Angeles. Ah, much easier...
Another example: I heard an interview with an MP on the committee that is currently questioning Karlheinz Schreiber. This MP was explaining that since testimony before the committee cannot be used to later prosecute a witness, it wouldn't be necessary for Schreiber to "take the fifth".
I once mentioned to a friend that I was reading a book of Canadian history."Canadian history? That's BORING." I replied that this particular book was actually rather interesting, and my friend refused to believe me.
This is a typical view for some. In high school, I knew many people who aspired to move to the US because they perceived it as being more exciting than boring little Canada. In fact, I had a friend that I nicknamed "Captain America." Her dreamed of either becoming a fighter pilot in the USAF, or moving to LA to be a porn producer (don't ask...).
I love living in Canada (I immigrated here from the US two years ago) but I have the same complaints that impudent strumpet does—it can be incredibly frustrating to hit the Sorry! US-only! wall with online shopping and TV and music. They are minor complaints, of course, when balanced against the health care and mat leave and all that, but complaints nonetheless.
(And then there are things like this. Argh.)
"So, what brought you down to the US?" is a question I am asked at least once per week. And, like Laura, I temper my response based on what I know about the person posing the question. The truth is that I came down here for a job and the fact that my best friend had moved here (Atlanta).
"So, you must love the lower taxes here?". In my estimation any difference in taxes is eaten up by healthcare premiums and co-pays so no, that's not it.
"Are you going to become a citizen?". That's a tricky one. There's no way that I'm going to become a US citizen but I don't want to insult anyone with a flat out rejection, I am Canadian after all.
"So, what do you think of the upcoming election?" Here's my chance to be really honest and not worry about offending anyone. My prevailing opinion about the elections down here are that they go on for too long and an appalling amount of money is spent on them. Imagine if that money was directed towards literacy programs or health care. This usually tells them all they need to know about my political opinions. If they press it further I point out that I cannot vote here but do participate in the Canadian elections. Of course this kind of response was learned over serveral years of being too upfront and then either receiving a lecture in which I was branded a communist and told to go home or told that I should be grateful for all the protection that Canada has received from the US over the years.
"Well, Canada is practically the US anyway. hahaha." That's my cue to go and find someone else to chat with.
It's like Deja Vu, I cannot tell you how many times I have had this conversation with others...sigh
I didn't mean to suggest that this was exclusively a television issue, but a cultural one. We are bombarded in Canada with American cultural products, which I said, glorify consumer capitalism and fail to examine the fact that over 40 million Americans live below the poverty line. Not that Canada doesn't have its fair share of poverty which seems to come out in our media (at least the CBC), where American cultural products tend to celebrate the "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous" over social commentary.
America is much better than Canada when it comes to creating a national mythology.
A shortcoming which, I think, has been nothing but positive for us!
Here's an exercise for Canadian readers of this blog: visualize the Oval Office. Got it? OK, now visualize the Prime Minister's office.
How many times has the Prime Minister's office been seen in a movie or TV show? The number's probably about the same as the number of TV episodes of the Air Farce.
For that matter, how many times has a Canadian Prime Minister -- real or fictional -- been a character in a movie or TV show, compared to US Presidents?
"America is much better than Canada when it comes to creating a national mythology."
I somewhat agree. However, I would argue that the fact that there's so much more American culture around us than there is Canadian, it's difficult to disseminate those national myths. I would argue that before there was so much American mass culture in our market Canadians had a stronger sense of history and identity, ie the last spike in the railroad, the Riel Rebellion. Granted, that identity was a white-Anglophone one, but it was still there for those included in the general society.
These are all rather interesting things, which have plenty of mythological potential (think Tommy Douglas and medicare, Trudeaumania, the Charter etc. as more "universal" myths to appeal to all Canadians). These myths are just as, if not moreso appealing to the majority of compassionate, educated people that Canada is made up of than "the rockets red glare." We are just at such a disadvantage to distribute those myths since much of our media has nothing to do with the people in this country that are actually watching it.
Just to clarify, I have no problem with American culture as it stands, it's mass culture that's the trouble.
I once mentioned to a friend that I was reading a book of Canadian history."Canadian history? That's BORING."
Here's a great write-up of a piece of Canadian history that occurred 90 years ago today, one which makes for great myth-making (and for which there is, or at least was, a nice Canadian History vignette on CBC).
Well, the U.S. is really too big for effective Martial Law.
And I never really thought about it before but maybe Martial Law is my official breaking point.
That defence budget has got to come from somewhere.
Yeah, thank you, China. :D
Hey, thanks for all the good comments while I was away. Lorna's is especially interesting to me. I can perfectly visualize these conversations, the assumptions the Americans make, how Lorna seeks to navigate through them.
If I had a dollar for every post on this blog about Canadians believing their own history is boring, and not having Large National Myths.... I'd have quite a few dollars. To me it's a welcome change, as James implies.
Also, Canadians may say their history is boring, but Americans don't know they're own history at all. Americans are incredibly ahistorical, and largely substitute myths and propaganda for actual history. I'm not saying this is peculiar to Amercian culture, I wouldn't know. I'm just saying it is.
And I never really thought about it before but maybe Martial Law is my official breaking point.
And by that time, by definition, it will be too late.
The US will never need national martial law to meet its objectives. It has already imposed martial law in local instances, such as in New Orleans. They have very successfully set up the dictatorship without resorting to something so overt, so why bother.
It makes me so proud to be an American. I live in a country where, after those who Hate Freedom attacked us (and thank God for Rudy, the Mayor, for being there on that day; he will make a GREAT President), we had a good strong leader in W. stand up and tell us everything was OK. How did we know? We could go SHOPPING!!
God Bless the U S A
Good thing I know you're kidding, AviShalom.
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